Can we get some transparency please [about reduce shop prices for LA servers]

Please give us a feedback like the recent “message from the team”
Amazon Games & Smilegate RPG Message From the Team

The lack of communication and transparency we are getting from both AGS and SGR is insane to me. they’re ignoring it, like we’re not important. The open letter was almost perfect, the only thing missing was to talk about this problem.

Honestly, I still have hopes that they will regionalize prices. But I wanted an answer whether or not they are going to do it, if they aren’t going to make it, just say it at once, and don’t keep rolling us around. This is disturbing.

The Brazilian population is practically 220.000.000 people, +50% of all people living in South America.

More than half of Brazilians earn less than 1 minimum wage, the new Skin Omen costs 10% of 1 Brazilian minimum wage.

The prices charged in our South America region at the Lost Ark cash shop are totally wrong for the economic reality of our region.

This needs to be changed and we need feedback from Amazon Games Service regarding this issue, aka AGS.

New World was priced regionally for our region on Steam, the result was thousands of players from South America buying the game, consequently more than 70,000 players queued up on the servers.

Some more data and additional information from the forum itself, to add to the discussion.

They are charging BRL5.5 for each $1

The dolar to BRL conversion is BRL 5 to 1.

Packs are more expensive in Brazil then in the USA, while Brazil have a worse economy.

The 12k gem pack is half our minimun wage already, they shouldnt be charging the dolar more then its worth at least.

Prices Localization - #3 by Sourjack

*put it as simple as I can: *US money is worth 5 to 6 times more than BR money

Regional prices for South America

The Aura pricing is just WAY too much for us here, its 5x more expensive then a Amazon Prime sub (FIVE TIMES).

Without regional pricing for SA servers, its 100% cheaper to buy gold from 3p websites

The 30 Day Cristaline aura for example, is right now at 56R$, if you compare to WOW montly sub is right now at 32R$.
But if we compare those prices on NA

Prices Localization

The price of Crystalline in my country (Brazil) is unaffordable. R$56,00 is too much, take Final Fantasy for example, their subscription is R$28,99 here.
The skins are also very expensive, usually we find skins in the Brazilian market for about R$40-60.00 and Lost Ark gave is for over R$100.00!
I just wanted to point this out because there must be more people interested in spending on the game, but not for these values. It is better for you 5 people buying Crystalline for $29.00 than 2 buying for $56.00, just do the math, the same goes for all the rest of the content of the store.

Region Prices adjustment

Like I said, they would make much more money selling Crystalline for R$29,00 to 5 people (R$145) than R$56,00 to 2 (R$112).

Region Prices adjustment - #3 by Coldasice

To give everyone just a small perspective, omen skin just got to the shop on todays latest update, costing 2,000 Royal Crystals just the basic skin set, if I would want to buy just the skin, no weapon or mount, I would have to buy the 2,200 Royal Crystals pack for R$113,99. Just to give context, this represents 9,41% of Brazil minimum wage which is R$1212,00 at the moment, almost 10% of minimum wage for just the skin. If I wanted to get the whole skin Special Package I would have to pay R$278,99 which is 1/4 of the minimum wage. Keeping the monetization for SA converting directly from USD as it is will unfortunately push a lot of people away from putting some money on skins or essentials.

Prices Localization - #2 by Cardistry

Saying that I will provide some reality of Brazil so you guys could compare.
Right now on server you can buy 12000 Royal Crystals for 99USD, and in brazillian accounts 576.99RS (equals to 109USD). For those who earn in USD exemple USA, the minimum wage is about 11USD hourly, in Brazil the reality is totally different, the minimum wage is about 8RS hourly, that means 1.60USD hourly. Even for a crystaline aura that is 56.99RS is hard.

South America Market Reality

It is better if you sell something thousands of times for 1$ then if you sell it once for $100, it’s not like Amazon will lose any money by making the prices fair for SA, since they already paid Smilegate for that content anyway.

Latin America is the 4th biggest gaming market in the world, with Brazil being the 10th country worldwide, so we have a lot of paying players willing to support the game, but if things are too expensive people won’t be spending on them.

Regional prices for South America - #14 by JackSlugger

SA is priced high on crystals (exchange for gold) because noone is using their credit cards to buy royal crystal, then exchange it for gold, compared to NA/EU where everyone does it.

It is comparable to the Korean server that has been in existence for 4 years.

This is insanely expensive.

The solution is very simple and easy.

Regionalize prices.

So there’s a big problem in SA servers, and nobody answers about it

The prices for one single skin on SA is about R$278,00 for royal crystals compared to minimun wage of R$1.200,00 is just too much. You can eat the entire month with this value and the rest use for basic needs or rent etc, depends.

Skin Prices on SA :frowning:

Just for Brazil, whenever you see a price, multiply it by 5, so yea we are paying 500 bucks for the US$ 99 pack.

Thanks for killing the SA region!

For context, as of today a 1 real is worth 5.12 dollars.

In tree of savior a Token just last month cost me R$30 (roughly 6 bucks) which is already a bit pricy for me, but given the current local economy it’s sort of understandable.

Last year the same token used to cost R$15 which is a extremely accessible price for almost any player.

Currently, a Crystaline Aura in Lost Ark bought with real cash is around R$57.

If anything, the high price of blue crystals seem to suggest to me that players are buying very little orange crystals or at least not converting much to blue crystals.

In my opinion whoever is setting the prices for this region is loosing the company a lot of money and making a comfortable game experience inaccessible for a lot of players.

[SA] Crystaline Aura is obscenely overpriced

People in SA are playing in SA, and not in any other server.

We should have a proper price based on South America ability to pay. And have it be not related to other regions.

[SA] Crystaline Aura is obscenely overpriced - #10 by Orsini

It doesn’t make sense to localize a game halfway.

Why make things global like that.

League of Legends for example has good prices por it’s local servers.

Many games do.

It just doesn’t make sense to price things globally.

[SA] Crystaline Aura is obscenely overpriced - #11 by Orsini

The price set up for the region of Brazil is using the Dolar exchange to Reais(Brazil’s currency) back when the dollar was at it’s all time high of U$1,00 to R$5,70, since then, the dollar has plummeted to R$5,42 and it continues to do so and until the FED calms down in the US the dollar will continue plummeting.
For the second part of this topic, the economy in Latin America can not keep up with these asked prices, a simple U$99 for a game though not abusive translates to R$567,00 which is too much. Brazilians make on average R$1.200,00 a month before taxes so R$567,00 for a game is basically half of their salary,

Wrong pricing for Brazil

GDP per capita (current US$) - United States - 65.000,00 USD ‌
GDP per capita (current US$) - United States - Latin America & Caribbean - 7.400,00 USD ‌

Almost 9 times more than South America

EDIT 1:

I’ve been looking for solutions, and I found one of them is right in front of us. We can learn with Smilegate.

The Lost ark game is not designed to share items or VIP with regions. Each region has its own separate economy. There is the Korean server, the Russian server and the Japanese server, and they are completely separate from each other. Simple and objective.

Here for us the greatest difficulty in regionalizing is due to the fact that what a person buys on the SA server can be used on the NA or EU server, it wouldn’t be much easier to leave these servers completely individualized and isolated from each other like SmileGate does with Russian, Japanese and Korean servers?

Each has its economy based on that country.

This would prevent fraud. People would not be able to buy items or vip on our server to use on their server.

@Seawolf @Roxx @Maselbart please, read this, I hope these changes occur before the death of SA servers…

I know there’s a lot of mechanisms, and several possible solutions. Let us know if this is a priority for Amazon and how advanced they are on it. I’m willing to help and share everything I know about it.

Edit 2:

Just to contribute a little bit more to the topic.

Here are some examples of other games that regionalize pricing to put in perspective.
Using current US dollar exchange rate of 1USD to 4.92BRL

- League of Legends:

1380 RP costs 10USD
10USD = 49.20BRL
Regionalized pricing: 32BRL

- Path of Exile: using 150 premium tokens as example to buy that juice map stash tab

150 tokens costs 15USD
15USD = 73.80BRL
Regionalized pricing: 39.90BRL

- FF XIV Starter Edition Pack (Steam)

Costs 19.99USD
19.99USD = 98.35BRL
Regionalized pricing: 52.99BRL (almost half the conversion price)

I can go on all day with multiple different games.
Here are screenshots of some purchase pages with the different values:

PoE
USD:

BRL:

FFXIV
USD:
image

BRL:
image

Now to put Lost Ark into perspective, here is the price difference using the Apprentice Starter Pack (Steam) as an example:

USD:
image

BRL:
image

With that said, I can’t even imagine how much worse it must be to players from other SA countries like Argentina.

I hope we can get a response to this, even if it’s a negative one, just for clarification.

TLDR: If other companies in the industry can do this, why can’t AGS do the same?

edit 3: AGS said: “at this moment in time there are not current plans to regionalize prices in the game”

we have a reply for that

So brazilian people pay 15~16%(print) more than an american or any other region for the same amount of crystal and even then we don’t have portuguese translation in the game, forum with CMs in portuguese / support things that other servers have and still pay least for the same service?

And you tell me you have nothing on the subject to add?

Well when you have fiscal meetings and you see that brazilians don’t spend money on the game, don’t forget that we have the highest price on all the servers and you just " at this moment in time there are not current plans to regionalize prices in the game"

Regionalizing the price would be a good thing, but at the moment, in addition to not having that, we still pay 16% more than the Americans, it’s the first time I’ve seen this in a game, congratulations AGS and Smilegate!

WE WILL STILL KEEP FIGHTING FOR REGIONAL PRICES!

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@Roxx @Seawolf Please, give us a feedback like the recent “message from the team”
Amazon Games & Smilegate RPG Message From the Team

Honestly, I still have hopes that they will regionalize prices. But I wanted an answer whether or not they are going to do it, if they aren’t going to make it, just say it at once, and don’t keep rolling us around. This is disturbing.!

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Well said! I think they read and re-read and just ignore these. That makes us think like they really don’t care about losing SA players and their money (how crazy is that?).

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They need to announce an Amazon Games South America branch soon.
Even if it means just having a manager or two.

The bots are hitting us really hard making blue crystals reach 1k gold per stack already in the first month. That, plus these astronomical cash prices makes things really hard.

I feel like people from abroad think this issue doesn’t deserve attention, maybe because many countries have similar problems with currency today, in europe for example.

But they fail to understand how big Brazil’s population is and how hard we game over here.

We don’t even have as many people with computers as North America has and we get pretty close to their numbers anyway.

We have the culture and the numbers, just look at League of Legends data and make a proper profit curve for Lost Ark, for the love of god.

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F2P is absolutely huge in Brazil (I’m European btw.)

If Amazon doesn’t know that, they need some changes in their publishing department.

Prices should be localized asap to match the economy standards - as in the end it will cause more players to try it, and more purchases to be made. There is of course a curve, and a point that they cannot go below with prices (because then even if 1,000,000 new players join, they can still make less money than now) - but current state is unreal for a F2P game and your market.

AGS just seems to ignore this, as most likely their publishing team is not experienced enough in this type of games.

EDIT: I think I need to put a bit more context here as well.

Prices on steam can be localized pretty easily - the steam backend allows you to put a price of your choice per currency of your choice.

While pricing the DLCs - so i.e. Vanquisher packs - on low R$ price may cause people to buy it and then sell it on pages like G2A for few dollars, there is also a way to prevent that. You can always create multiple packages per DLC, that are locked to a specific Region only. So i…e you cannot purchase and gift or redeem the DLC in region other than South America. This can be done, and it is quite simple

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Roxx or one of the other CMs have replied before regarding this. They mentioned that they are looking into it, the main concern that they have and why there is no regional pricing yet is that they are worried that it will attract people from other regions using VPNs to take advantage of the lower prices in the SA region if they do so. This may not seem like a big deal but it would actually lead to a serious imbalance within the servers as someone from the US for example would have like 2x the buying power than anyone in SA and they would dominate the servers.

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If they region-lock packs (including Royal Crystal packs), this will be against ToS and easily detectable by Valve - leading to a steam ban.

The only way to work around this would be for a person to make a new account while on VPN, set region to SA, and keep playing on the VPN forever.

I say this again, AGS is just lacking experienced people in their Publishing Team it seems. Maybe they are very experienced in Boxed releases, or P2P MMO releases, or just regional releases, but they seem to lack in this department. Maybe they need a good sub-publisher for South America market?

Edit: Since the Royal Packs are hidden from store list of DLCs, it makes this even easier, as they can code/API directly to regional locked packages and ignore teh storefront altogether.

@Roxx there needs to be something more behind this than the reason mentioned by Shalis, right?

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That’s why I think they are keeeping bots into game. So we prefer buy pack directly from shop instead buy it with gold.

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Believe me, they don’t. They are bleeding reputation and money due to it. It is not in favour for anyone, and people who believe that somehow bots are making Amazon free money, do not fully understand how this works.

The only reason I can think of is, as stated above, having in-experienced publishing team when it comes to global or SA F2P releases. (and sub-par steam backend knoweldge is one more thing:P)

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@Roxx @Seawolf

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Sadly, I don’t think CMs react to tagging them… but I have tried as well :confused:

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This is not a real scenario. The low prices thing only was a concern because you could transfer your purchase.

Of course, mmos have different cash bundles locked to specific server by item ID’s which for some reason wasn’t the case with Lost Ark.

Nobody migrates to an alien server and stays there long term just for prices. They don’t understand the language nor the culture and as a result start feeling out of place pretty quick as guilds and friends will matter a lot for this kind of heavy spender competitive type player.

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Just going to comment on your last assumption at the end there. Portuguese is actually one the most common spoken languages worldwide due to the large amount of expats everywhere… myself included. I live in canada and i speak portuguese, i could go on the brazilian servers with no issue and i would have a much much higher purchasing power than the average brazillian or south american player.

One of the main incentives that people play MMOs for is to lord over others, people would absolutely go to a foreign server even if they didn’t speak the language if it meant they had an advantage to do so. Heck even when they don’t, people still do it, i’ve played japanese and korean mmos that were region locked before, as have many others which you can easily see here in lost ark with the amount of veterans from Kr/Ru/JP release.

please @Seawolf clarify for us

We need a satisfaction about this @Roxx @Seawolf

Turkish community has the same problem sadly.

Example ; avarage sallary is 3000 turkish lira and a skin costs 580 turkish lira. Soo expensive. Yes our economy is bad but this is an MMO. We also wanna look cool like others. Bring regional prices for skins plz.

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On second thought, you are right. I failed to notice this issue.

I guess Amazon did a great job stopping this from taking place.

But at what cost?

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@Seawolf @Roxx

I know of the localization pricing on many package games is a thing, but doing the same on a global MMORPG does not sound fair or right. In agreement to Shalis above, basic language can be learned quickly to play the game, or they could even group among themselves to enjoy the “cheaper” gameplay.

For competitive games like League of Legends, subscription-based models that cannot be bought with in-game currency like New World or FFXIV, does not provide you the advantage in-game because they can be bought cheaper. But everything that you mentioned in Lost Ark, like Crystal packages and skin sets that can be sold in-game, actually affects the in-game economy.

You can buy almost everything with Blue Crystals (including Crystalline Aura), which you can also get “free” by selling the gold.

Hello - non-BR person here and I fully support adjusting prices based on local area. Your buying power is different from those in NA, and the in-game prices should reflect that. Additionally, there should be region-lock, to keep people from outside SA “deal” with the ping to have greater buying power due to currency conversion.

Hoping AGS can get their senses together for you all.

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