If they changed it so that honing was no longer RNG and you just needed the necessary amount of materials, would you like that more or like that less? Obviously, it’d be balanced out such that it would average the same amount of time now, so the question really comes down to would you prefer just being material drops and you hit the minimum necessary and pop, that’s it, you gain a honing level. Breaths et al would then reduce the cost by a certain percent based on how many you apply and would either drop from significantly more places or with greater quantity from current sources. There could even be semi rare materials that drop that give a free hone for their ilvl range.
I feel inclined to believe I’d prefer it this way. Dealing with RNG is just not fun, not in this context, and every single damn MMO and other game that was such pure, bland RNG to gain in power it felt like such a terrible chore and like I was being punished for bad luck. Practically every game out there relies on RNG to some extent, sure, especially RPGs, but the really good ones don’t lock progression behind such rigid RNG like so many asian MMOs do. Knowing that I need X amount of Y to hone, implemented well, I think would feel so much better to players because then the RNG comes in reducing the costs of that next hone. At least on paper, that seems like a far better system, and from experience I think I’d prefer such a system to the current one, because perception is a huge factor in how fair something feels. If this change happened and people just honed when they had the mats, most players would like it better and remaining aspects of RNG surrounding honing would feel better and more rewarding (using breaths does NOT feel rewarding right now).
Thoughts?
tl;dr - Would you like the following system more or less than what we have: Honing is now always 100%, you just need the mats for it, it’s averaged out to be comparable to current rates, and bonus chance mats like breaths would be changed to flat a reduction in those costs. Sound better or worse to you?
Using what you just said, imagine if you full pitied all your gear pieces for each lvl +1 - +15 for each tier (T1, T2 & T3) then once again you full pitied them all to achieve 1445 for Valtan.
This is the type of system you are ultimately proposing as there is no luck involved only grinding for the necessary materials.
if this is the case, there r a spread of the total amount of mats they can choose to set as the fixed value, so which value u reckon they should set at?
for example, when u r extremely lucky, maybe 20k gold, 10k stones, 10k shards and 200 oreha stone could take u str8 to 1415. however, when u r extremely unlcuky, maybe at least 50k gold, 30k stones, 30k shards and 500 oreha stone could take u to 1415.
With the current honing system the full cost is the pity cost. Every time you pay a specified portion of that cost you have a increasing chance at a decreasing discount.
If the pity cost is 4000 gold worth of materials. And you click the hone button every 400 gold worth of materials. You are really just getting a chance at a 3600 discount, then a 3200 discount, then a 2800 discount, and so forth until you reach the full price of 4000 gold worth of materials.
Why on Earth would I, as a player, want this over the current system? It just means more grinding, this sounds like you just are salty and don’t wanna rationalize at all. Sometimes you pity, and it sucks, sometimes you one tap, and you just saved yourself thousands of gold at higher ilvls. You don’t lose anything for pushing like you do in other games like BDO where you’re gear can lose gearscore. So why would any rational player ever want this?
Not sure, cuz then the weird and difficult to balance part would be how good would the up front costs feel to see? The advantage is that we know the maximum we need outright, so if drops and all were altered (or the system rebuilt from the ground up to accommodate this more sensibly than the basic premise I offered) such that the average time it takes to hone any given tier of an ilvl for a single piece is factored into those drop rates, and we also got the occasional free hone mat and breaths became cost reduction mats, I don’t know… it’d require experimenting for sure. All I know is I just get frustrated as hell at this game’s dumb RNG. It’s a similar reason why every time I play Path of Exile again i burn out partway into red maps because it’s just layers of layers of layers of RNG and it’s the same pile of crappy rolls with little discernible improvement.
lol, its ok if u dont know, bro~ but i would suggest u to have a look at a statistics concept called “probablility distribution”.
I agree that the honing system is not the best. but I do know whoever designed this system is/are a well-educated engineer(s) and has/have put a lot of thoughts into the system.
if u ever wanna challenge their/his idea, u might have to put more thoughts into ur suggestions.
The current system is terrible and can improve but what you’re proposing is worse. However, if your proposal comes with a reduction in total mats required (assuming all pities in our current system) then yes, i can support it. Otherwise, i take my chances of having some pieces at pity, some at 75% artisan, some at 25% artisan, some at 1 tap (T1-T2 with stronghold hone buff)
No, it would not automatically mean more grinding. If it were built appropriately such that the current average clicks/mats to hone–from the lucky low percent hits on one end and pities on the other–we’d have at minimum the advantage of knowing exactly what you need at the worst instance. It would change such that we get the occasional free hone and we’d also collect cost reduction mats (what the Breaths would become). Would you prefer to know the maximum mats necessary to hone to +15 and have full agency over how much the cost goes down? Or would you prefer tapping again and again and again and again and maybe this time throw in some breaths and oh still failed and tapping again ad nauseum until you get lucky or pity or discover all your day’s grinding meant nothing because Artisan’s hit 98% and you ran out of leapstones or something? The very honing process itself is also a damned chore of a clunky and slow UI on top of it all, so I’d welcome just about any change to make it less tedious and painful. Gameplay systems should at least not feel inherently “unfun” if you follow.
Well, yes, it would be factored against the average of current taps to pities and go one from there. If it currently cost at full pity (numbers out of my ass for sake of the point) 20k crystals and 1500 leapstones and 25k gold to 1370 to 1415 then they would average out against that and how often people tap before pity, such that it would cost flat maybe 15k crystals and 1000 leapstones and 18k gold which players reduce with breaths et al. The whole idea here is to determine whether people would feel better about a flat “You’ll get it when you can afford it” honing system with means of reducing costs OR would they prefer the current system of dice rolls? Not exactly meaning to offer my basic premise as the absolute execution.
No, I think you misunderstand me. The basic premise is: Full cost up front, cost reduction mats drop, free hone mats drop semi rarely as a bonus, thus changing how the RNG is applied so it feels fairer, even if the average costs and grinding time remain more or less the same.
My idea is a basic premise of what it could be. The post is intended to figure out if players would prefer the RNG of the honing system or change how the RNG applies. Even if they could implement a form of my idea such that it’s a flat cost and players simply reduce that cost with added mats, that the average grind time remained the same, the average time to hone to content milestones, it all remained the same, it’s just where the RNG gets applied is changed to be more background than foreground, would that feel better and seem fairer?
I guess my OP failed to convey that, everyone thinks I’m just asking for flat mat costs and ignoring the substance of my proposal. “That’s what pity is” means either you failed to comprehend my thoughts or I failed to convey them well enough.