The game is not reasonably accessible because of the massive queue times, which continue to get longer.
Unfortunately, it is currently impossible to get a refund through Steam Support, and Amazon Games refuses to provide a refund.
There are many ways to address unfair and/or deceptive business practices–one option is to contact the appropriate state’s attorney general’s office or consumer protection division.
Thanks for posting that, because it raises an important distinction: Nobody made purchases with a disclosure that the game would not be reasonably accessible. The issue is access, not the content/items themselves (which you don’t own anyway).
Steam isn’t really the problem, unless Amazon is saying go to Steam for recourse (which they have said in part, but they have also just denied refunds on their own).
Hello hiber, I noticed your post because it’s infers some intent to take action within a law.
These sort of things I do find interesting because of the documentation available and accepted by all users typically when downloading a game to play.
I don’t want to “rain on your parade” so to speak but taking any legal action is something not to be taken lightly.
Now I am not in the legal profession myself but would like to bring your attention to some things in those documents listed above. Keeping in mind that all users have agreed to accept the terms in these documents whether or not a user has read them.
Within the terms of use you have section 2.6 In-Game Items. and
section 5.7 Disputes which may be relevant.
I personally would think about it allot before trying to take any legal action against a game company especially a company that has the potential to bring very expensive lawyers with them.
You may also try and mitigate your personal costs by considering a class action in an effort to spread the costs out over many people but again I would bring your attention to Section 5.7 of the Terms of Use where class actions rights are waived.
I do understand your frustration at not being able to access the game at a time of your choosing and by that I assume you are referring to a long log-in queue, which if the case is something the Dev’s would be well aware of by now and should be looking to implement a resolution to.
Thanks for identifying certain provisions of the Terms of Use, such as the class-action waiver. That is why a complaint to a state’s attorney general’s office is an option, because it is unlikely any single user can gain recourse on their own. Any such office can investigate if necessary and determine whether to proceed.
It’s not particularly worthwhile to get into the weeds, but as for Section 2.6, it says many things beyond the scope of the issue here. It says that users cannot sell their accounts, that they don’t own their characters (i.e., users cannot insist that their class never gets nerfed), and provides many other limitations related to users’ control over in-game content.
Yet, the provision doesn’t excuse Amazon from providing reasonable access to the game. Nobody would have made purchases (or played at all) under the level of access we all know to exist now, and which not only hasn’t improved for months, it is indeed worse than it’s ever been. So to refuse to provide a refund is unfair and/or deceptive, when the problem persists for months on end and continues to worsen.
No one’s demanding that they get to play during maintenance, for example. We’re asking for the kind of reasonable access that is inherent in any MMORPG, or else receive a refund for the failure to provide it.
Thank you @shaikh.ob
I like rules based discussions because I find them easy, you know, black and white.
I found this information quite quickly and can only imagine how a lawyer or team of lawyer’s would respond to a claim like this in court.
@hiber, thanks for your response.
Again, yes I understand your frustration particularly because I am a user that plays on a server located in N/A West which is currently undergoing inordinate queue times.
Another thing however that should a case be brought before the courts about this issue may be the fact that the company has taken reasonable steps to curb and deal with the illegal activity of bot program users and continues to take steps.
It could be claimed that the current ongoing issue of in exhaustive queue’s is in direct relation to the ongoing bot issue and as such the company has taken enough action and steps in an attempt to mitigate the issue.
Again I am not a legal professional in any means but rather just a layman and I could see a case like this only costing the applicant much time and money with no outcome to their advantage.
Not to mention that this is a free to play game, and any money you put into it will was your choice. That and the other post mention of of the TOS, sounds like a long shot. Or like, a snowballs chance in hell. Good luck. Lol
2.2 Game Services. Some of our Games must be played over the Internet, and may require other services offered by us, our affiliates, or third parties. We do not guarantee service uptime or availability, and we are not responsible for any downtime. We may implement security features on the Games, Game Services, and your account, and you will not, and will not authorize or enable anyone to, circumvent or interfere with any security features.
Also under 5.7 it states
You may also be entitled to certain consumer protection rights under the laws of your local jurisdiction
So depending on your local laws you may actually be able to make a case here. But im not a lawyer and dont claim to know anything about these laws.
He is likely referring to the long queue times on NA West. Some servers hit 10k regularly and the queues can take a very long time to get through. Not uncommon for people to get disconnected while waiting as well so they end up getting to the end of the queue only to be greeted by a disconnected error. AGS/SGR do have a very serious problem on their hands here that needs to be resolved quickly. Not even a matter of legality its just bad for business
That’s a couple of good finds in the documentation there @Bluecogs.
I do know that Steam made some changes to their documentation because of our consumer protection laws in Australia.
I too think the OP is referring to the long queue’s on NA West servers but I do think attempting to take legal action will be a fruitless action at best.
I would be happy to take this case if you wanted to proceed, however you should be aware 85%-90% of the time the game manufacturer provides enough protection for themselves in either the EULA and/or the ToS.
Also you should be aware these cases can be seen as expensive by the general public. My firm would ask for $25,000 retainer with a $680 hourly billable regardless of outcome.
Thanks for the thoughtful response. As mentioned, filing a complaint about a business’s unfair and/or deceptive conduct is different from pursuing legal action directly.
It is normal to request a refund when a service is not accessible the way everyone understood it would be accessed (and used), and there is no subsequent fix over a period of months. Here, Amazon has refused to provide a refund even though the game is not reasonably accessible. That is the basis for a complaint.
