We need to seriously address the unfair ban issue

Hello there,

We know AGS have been trying to stop botting and RMT, but a lot of innocent people are suffering in the process. Yesterday my friend got banned. He is completely legit and never RMTed in this game. Over 20 people can vouch for him, and also he was regularly streaming, so it was easy to keep track of his gold and item progression. He has over 1600 hours in the game, and he is very depressed right now because he got banned for nothing. He was doing a lot of bussing recently, so that’s probably why the system red flagged him and blindly banned as a result.

My problem with all that is that we know that many people are in the same situation right now, and they have to wait in that limbo because their appeals might be waiting for WEEKS and even MONTHS in some cases. This is obviously unacceptable. Props to AGS for fighting the bots and RMT, but I think it’s a really serious issue right now because those people may not come back after many weeks of waiting. If some of them, including my friend, RMTed on the side, then the ban should not be lifted, but the support at the very least should review those appeals in a timely manner. Several weeks for an MMO is a huge amount of time, and when those people have to wait and see all their progression going down the drain because the support team cannot help them, it’s simply disheartening.

I hope a CM would reply in this thread on the current situation - please make ban appeal tickets top priority and investigate each case fairly because some of them are submitted by innocent people who have been suffering for no reason. Thank you and stay safe!

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We have a lot of threads on the topic and I’m sure they are well aware if it makes you feel any better.
And:

While threads like this don’t ever resolve judgement. They do raise awareness to the matter. You’ll find plenty in the same situation. So hopefully we’ll get some sort of feedback in relation to the ban/appeal system. Even if a handful of players are absolved, it’s obviously worth it.

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I understand that this thread is by any means unique, but I think more people need to speak up. Every week passing by without a concrete solution to the issue, it’s less and less likely that the unfairly banned people would come back to the game. It also makes people more paranoid. I used to bus HM Valtan regularly. I won’t be doing it anymore because I don’t want to get banned and placed on the bench for several weeks. I am even afraid to receive some gold loans from my guildmates (i.e. when I see a good accessory on the AH but I am 10-15k gold short) because I might get banned for “RMT”

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Doesnt matter if 20 ppl would vouch for him, even when he rmt, they would lie for him and
Somehow everyone who got banned is innocent and never did something ofc…

When hes 100% clean they would unban him via ban appeal but they found something i guess.
Maybe try to get the data from amazon, so he can see what happen

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Justice for anyone who is falsely banned :frowning:

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And punishment for everyone who rmt :wink:

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All I’m saying is that many people know he is legit. It’s not a piece of evidence, obviously, and should never be. Like I said before, if he secretly RMTed, then the ban must stay on. But I know that he is clean and cannot play the game for no reason and there is nothing concrete stated about how this would be resolved (if at all) besides that they are aware of the situation. I think this issue should have an emergency status and should addressed immediately because those ban waves are bleeding out innocent players that might never come back again.

The thing is not that they are banning people for no reason. The problem is that they are not elaborating the reason they banned people and since you can’t actually prove a negative, they can’t actually prove their innocence. I think the whole system is flawed. They are too ruthless towards appeals, it shows up a lot especially when someone innocent gets banned.

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All in saying, you cant trust anyone 100%…
I had few ppl on my guild who told me they spend so much money for royal crystals, in the end they got banned for rmt and everyone who got banned will claim hes clean to get the acc back its normal doe

When he he did nothing wrong, good luck
and Amazon can see if something is not right and can track the money

Like i said before, try to get the account data from amazon to see what happen

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I’ve seen the data and some don’t show any reason other than cheating, and then a random set of letters for the penalty ID, so not necessarily helpful other than showing when penalty ends.

I have to say this as well, from a business standpoint, you can’t trust anyone 100% either. For them to admit they have been wrong in banning many players that are innocent, you realize how bad that would look on them and in the office. Not a lot of people are thinking about that who may not come from a corporate background. But what players can’t prove, they also can’t prove and can just say what they want without any repercussions.

Not saying that is happening either, but just something to think about. Let it be known that your system was that flawed and caused a lot of players to lose countless amounts of time in the game, who will also end up wanting compensation for that. Now also having to answer to whoever else for how this massive problem was able to be permitted.

That’s all I have to say on it though, everyone has their own opinion at the end of the day.

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Imagine being so devoted to the game so that you start providing busses for some extra income and you get banned for it.

It makes perfect sense to me if the useless automated system flags legit players who sell a lot of low level gems for high price (7-9k for Vykas HM busses) and ban them.

Playing this game requires some nerves for sure.

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The problem is that they don´t really care.

If this continues, we will eventually lose interest to log in. Players are trying to do whatever they can to get at least some gold to be able to progress/play. It seems if you try too hard you will get perma banned with no reason or evidence.

Trying to resolve it means to speak with bots via support e-mail. Not only they are not helpfull, they also seem to appear on live chat and typing the same sentences over and over again with no real progress.
I hope that other game studious are watching what amazon is doing with the game that does not belong to them and no one would ever want to cooperate with them anymore in the future.
Hopefully game studios will choose their providers more carefully considering Amazon´s tarnished reputation in the game industry

I would add that amazon hopefully learned their lesson and will never develop another game if they are not even capable to provide meaningfull player support.

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Is it in their Terms of Service or Code of Conduct that they have to state why they ban players? I wouldn’t be surprised if it states that they don’t have to disclose this type of information to the banned user

I believe it’s less about what was done now more on to, how to prove a player didn’t do what is being claimed.

Looks as if a lot of the bans happening now are “RMT” bans, but almost anyone can be banned for it if you receive gold or send gold it can be flagged and you can end up being banned.

The problem with this is there was never an issue about receiving gold before, so for this to happen all of a sudden it causes players to receive bans, so with no way to actually determine if a player actually went to a website or spoke amongst someone to buy gold with real money offsite. There is only speculation on who they receive from, which was never against the rules, and as an AGS specialist pointed out a player can’t track who has a bot account from their end.

So that means players should be told of a new rule which states you can’t receive gold essentially until they figure this out, because at the end of the day regardless of if you are suspicious of a player we all play online so anyones account could technically be that “bot/fraud account” getting illegitimate gold and giving it to you and causing you to receive a ban.

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Indeed they can’t tell if you got a deal on a third party website or other service (like for example Discord).
They can however assume that someone selling lvl1 gem for 100k gold is RMT, because no one would buy that gem for that amount. They could of course have some additional rules, like amount of gold, frequency of this happening, who bought it (was it a legit player by mistake or account banned for botting?).
If you are getting 2k gold for selling bus gem and then you actually do that raid together with character that bought your gem then they can potentially track this too and whitelist this purchase (if they track this stuff).

So in theory they could be making RMT bans with pretty good accuracy if they wanted to. Do they have good accuracy? Dunno, but I hear that everyone in jail is innocent and at least 20 friends can vouch for that if asked. He good boi. :yawning_face:

This is a good point and has been raised but it brings loads of speculation. For instance, people that are currently banned for receiving donations that could be framed as RMT. This quickly becomes a double-edged sword though because loads of advertisement for Lost Ark (on twitch, major audience, probably don’t play the game or barely do but will casually and not know issues via forums) is on platforms where mass amounts of resources are generated via donations/shop purchases/honing resources via mail/ other outlets. This puts an outward annotation that doing this is freely accepted and won’t be punished while AGS has taken a different stance. To expand on this quickly, that means transactions between players would ideally also be safe from punishment since most advertisement for the game contains it. Transactions from Bussing, pumping up a streamer’s character, selling gems in chat, or even paying for someone to make your character look cosmetically better (fashion designers, yes, they exist) would ideally be 100% safe and not worry players.

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Exactly, most players I’d say aren’t just sitting on forums, they tune into streams here and there and will play. You see countless people get donations constantly in streams, big or small.

Not to mention other places as someone said in discord, if someone chooses to they can prepay for a bus for multiple of their characters, or friends whichever, or even pay in advance for a month+ worth of busses. Point is we don’t know, and in the end if speculation is what is being banned on that is dangerous.

Like I said an actual statement needs to go out about even receiving gold or lock it as much as everyone would hate that, people are being banned for silly things that they can’t prove.

I can get on right now, and give @pyroaddict04 a message join his guild, tell him hey you want that T10 gem on market you can pay me back later over discord, all of while he receives however much the T10 Gem value is from me but oops its RMT gold tell cya later @pyroaddict04

Now yes this was just something made up, but of the people who all play again you can’t know what they are going through, and it’s not as simple as black and white for people. So a resolution is needed an alert something anything. So many people just getting banned left and right, but left with bots running rampant.

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Yea It took 6 days for me to get unbanned and there was no communication if I didnt contact them everyday, didnt even get a sorry or msg telling me I was unbanned. We deserve quality compensation this is ridiculous, I missed all my weeklies/dailies/raids and 2 wei card spawns happened that same week!

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Gratz on the unban! That’s what matters most.

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If you speak German I would recommend sending an appeal in German. From what I have seen they are more transparent and will include the date of the unban (no ban is permanent even though it says so ingame), the reason why you were banned and also the amount of gold you bought in case you were banned for RMT. Good luck all.

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